Kinoton FP30 / FP30F - Help

[Nehalem501]

Hello,

 

I’m sorry to write this in English, I’m French and I don’t speak German. 

 

I have recently acquired and old Kinoton projector. And I need help with the wiring and electrical equipment. The cinema that threw out the projector cut a lot of cables. I cannot find a manual for this old model. Could you help me please ?

 

Here are some photos of the projector:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/g7n7dllqohpr8m3/Photo 03-02-2019 10 26 11.jpg?dl=0

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ocrd8tet43dtii/IMG_2585.jpg?dl=0

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1j6wekawbwjo3g0/IMG_2574.jpg?dl=0

 

[Nehalem501]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Vogel]

Das Einlegeschema passt nicht zur Maschine, das obere Abdeckblech ist zu neu!

[Jensg]

This ist an old FP30, equiped with a Kinoton Reverse Scan Soundhead. So you have to look for the old manual for Kinoton FP30 at filmtech. And for the Soundhead for the techbulletin.

http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/

Jens

[Nehalem501]

Yes, it is an old FP30 that seems to have been upgraded with some new equipment.

 

I’ve searched everywhere for the manual of this projector but I can’t find it. It is not there on Film-Tech.

 

I found a manual here 

but the manual is for another FP30, the electrical equipment is different. On the boards of my projector it says « FP30F ». 

 

For the reverse scan soundhead there was no problem to find the manual. (https://www.rsem.com/pdf_manuals/Dolby/Current_Products/Dolby_Digital_Readers/Kinoton Basement Reader instructions.pdf)

 

Thank you for you help. 

Bearbeitet 20. Februar 2019 von Nehalem501 (Änderungen anzeigen)

[Jensg]

Ok, some of the manuals i have. A part in the manual fp30alt is in french.

Jens

kinotonfp23c_service.pdf

FP30 alt Manual.pdf

[dbx1000]

To me the wiring in the door frame looks like it has been heavily modified (loose cabling etc.)? You may find that this differs from the original circuit documentation.

 

It's a nice machine, but for this particular machine you will probably need to clean it up a bit electronically.

Bearbeitet 20. Februar 2019 von dbx1000 (Änderungen anzeigen)

[ccc.filmtheaterbetriebe]

Guten Tag, der Riss-Schalter verblüfft mich - war das bei der "alten" 30 ncht ein Reed-Kontakt?

Geteilte Rolle, die im Friktionsbetrieb recht gut funktioniert hat?

[Nehalem501]

4 hours ago, Jensg said:

Ok, some of the manuals i have. A part in the manual fp30alt is in french.

Jens

kinotonfp23c_service.pdf

FP30 alt Manual.pdf

 

In the FP23C manual the lens turret board seems very similar to the one on my FP30. So thanks for the link. 

For the FP30altManual, this is the manual I already have were the electronics are different from those in my projector. 

 

1 hour ago, dbx1000 said:

To me the wiring in the door frame looks like it has been heavily modified (loose cabling etc.)? You may find that this differs from the original circuit documentation.

 

It's a nice machine, but for this particular machine you will probably need to clean it up a bit electronically.

 

Actually this is what I want to do. I plan to disconnect everything and re-do all the wiring from scratch. But for that I need to know what has to be connected on each connector. This is why I’m looking for a manual that has the schematics for the same electronic boards that are in my FP30. The « FP30 alt manual.pdf » that was posted here has different electronics, with different connections.

 

The projector seems quite old as it still says « made in west-Germany » on it. 

Bearbeitet 20. Februar 2019 von Nehalem501 (Änderungen anzeigen)

[dbx1000]

Be careful when fully disassembling. The older kinoton circuit diagrams are often more overviews, rather than explicit wire run diagrams that 100% tell you which wire goes where: some wire names are used multiple times in several places (such as 20, 40, 60) which can be confusing. And the diagrams only show the resulting electrical connection. not how the wires are split across buses, connectors etc... this can making things very difficult.

 

I'd suggest to go through the wiring step by step, try to understand it (matching it to the manual), and document, weed out and replace as you proceed.

 

Stripping the whole wiring and then starting a new wiring from scratch would be a nightmare.

[Nehalem501]

For the moment I’ve only disconnected the wires that were cut and were connected to nothing. 

 

Before disconnecting the rest, I will be writing down which wire connects what and where in cas I never find the diagrams for my model. 

 

Yes I’ve seen the kind of diagrams to expect from my manual, but for me, if I could have the same kind of diagrams for the boards in my projector, it would be enough to understand broadly how everything works. 

 

As long as I have the pin-out of each connector, (I can know which wire is 220V power, or 24V, or some logic circuitry, etc ...) it will be enough to understand the minimum I need to have the main motor running. 

[Jensg]

for my opinion, it's not so difficult, because this is a relay electric and not an electronic. Motor drive and douser wiring ist not difficult, revolver steering also, two endswitches, finish. a little electronic for the opto s, that's all.

Jens

[Nehalem501]

There was a FP30F manual on eBay, however when I bought it the seller couldn’t find it anymore, so still looking for it if someone has a copy. 

 

[Florian]

Looking at this picture:

bottom left is the "normal" FP 30 board with relais for motor and douser and the supply for the old white soundlamp.

bottom right is the "F" automation board for start/stop, tabs, houselights and douser, working via aluminium foils on the film (situated left and right, two sensors).

The cemetery of relais above is not original.

 

[Nehalem501]

12 hours ago, Florian said:

Looking at this picture:

bottom left is the "normal" FP 30 board with relais for motor and douser and the supply for the old white soundlamp.

bottom right is the "F" automation board for start/stop, tabs, houselights and douser, working via aluminium foils on the film (situated left and right, two sensors).

The cemetery of relais above is not original.

 

Thanks for the information. If the bottom left board is for the "normal" FP30, I wonder why it's not in the FP30 manual I found. I don't really care about automation so I'll concentrate my efforts on figuring out the connections to this board only.

[Nehalem501]

Thanks for the help everyone, I’ve managed to get the motor running.